by the time i finished the profile it was late at night, and i was too excited to write out the OP, >.< but here goes!
Ni is one of the most misunderstood functions, so this was quite the experiment to try to pull off accurately, and the verdict is still out on that. Not having Ni myself, I can't speak from an inside-out experience so I approached this profile as a researcher. I transcribed the audio of multiple Ni-lead videos and aggregated the similarities together, and sourced from all I've learned of it second-hand.
But I didn't capture every shade of Ni. The profile is written mostly from the perspective of Ni-heavy types, so i imagine our polarized Ni-lead members might not relate as much?
a few well-appreciated opinions so far from discord:
@elsie7290 - has illuminated me to the fact that NeFi's can have affinities for this sort of Ni mysticism too. At least at the level of topic-interest (i.e. astrology, symbology, tarot, meditation, etc). As a whole it still seems far more apparent in high-Ni individuals, but these may be better viewed as general "N" topics. Yet somehow I'm gonna have to balance this with the fact that --despite a shared "N" space between Ne and Ni-- Ni still has a statistical strength in the aforementioned departments... which is objectively demonstrable. hmm, but perhaps the specificity can be turned down.
chilledtozero - has brought to my attention that the NiTe experience is a bit different (as "understanding systems as they live inside you, twisting and turning them in your head in an infinitely malleable way"), and that the profile lacks relatability and is a bit overly technical. i do think i need more insight on "how Ni users are on a day-to-day" and also how these attributes mesh into or affect their lives and relationships at work and with family/friends. if you guys have anything to add in that domain, please feel free.
Elsie - has illuminated me to the fact that NeFi's can have affinities for this sort of Ni mysticism too. At least at the level of topic-interest (i.e. astrology, symbology, tarot, meditation, etc). As a whole it still seems far more apparent in high-Ni individuals, but these may be better viewed as general "N" topics. Yet somehow I'm gonna have to balance this with the fact that --despite a shared "N" space between Ne and Ni-- Ni still has a statistical strength in the aforementioned departments... which is objectively demonstrable. hmm, but perhaps the specificity can be turned down.
Hey, along these same lines I wonder if "Metaphors & Visual Truisms" might be a general Pi trait to some extent...I related to a lot of stuff from that section in the way my own thought processes work. For instance:
The Ni user will be very graphic in their consciousness, thinking in visuals and representing the world through visual metaphors.
This could be quite a good description of how I experience Si. If I'm listening to music, I'll almost always "see" fluid images of the sounds I'm hearing.
I would imagine the sorts of images & analogies I would rely on as an Si user probably tend to be more grounded and/or local. An example of this I've noticed in heavy Si users (including myself) is the tendency to analogize the Earth to the individual. In fact, I would see this analogy as the essence of what Min is all about. (I've heard some Ni users express this idea as well, but I do think it has a grounding, earthy quality that appeals especially to Si). Also, while metaphors are important to me, I'd say impressions are more important: they're the glue that holds all the static datapoints together and makes them significant enough to remember. The sensory composition of these impressions is predominantly visual, but usually somewhat synasthetic. (Again, at some point I've been meaning to write something specifically about the topic of impressions).
For the Ni user, the world is not comprehended through words or axioms but through these visual relationships which words help to convey to others.
I think this is largely true for me as well. On the other hand, I think words certainly play a significant role in my comprehension. Not complete sentences so much as scattered fragments that tend to function as placeholders and help to structure visual relationships. So in this way maybe Si is a bit different. (Random aside: I also remember seeing a quote from NeFi Einstein basically saying that language didn't seem to play any role in his comprehension--that it was entirely visual. So I sort of suspect P-leads, on average, tend to be more visual & less verbal in their thinking than J-leads).
that's my understanding of it too, with the first profile section acting as a lead-in to the rest, by painting Ni as a P function. Being "P" is the main determiner there.. (relevant: cognitivetype.com/2017/12/01/judgment-perception-types/ ) @einstein - yes! he's a good example too. Iain McGilchrist references him in the vid of that link ^
I'm at least happy that various P-leads are resonating with the Ni profile, as I would expect that to be more the case. I personally don't relate to the Ni profile much at all, nor does Alerith or Jelle, which is great to see.
I do think something can be done to be more targeted about the section though.
I'll accumulate a few more insights before applying changes, but keep 'em coming!
Hrafn i'd love to read your explanation of Si impressions/senasthetics if you ever have time. @elsie7290 was actually just telling me about using synesthesia in her art for evocation too.
I'm at least happy that various P-leads are resonating with the Ni profile, as I would expect that to be more the case.
That makes sense--there were also parts of the Se profile I resonated with.
Hrafn i'd love to read your explanation of Si impressions/senasthetics if you ever have time. Elsie was actually just telling me about using synesthesia in her art for evocation too.
Oh, fascinating. Sure, I'll try & get to it before too long. It's a challenging topic to explicate, though, because I feel like the very nature of impressions is that they never seem quite 100% conscious. If their attributes become fully conscious & explicit they become more like details or features--the ambiguous, evocative, "pregnant unknown" quality that makes them impressions is lost.
Post by leeleechirps2.0 on Jun 18, 2018 19:18:55 GMT -5
Wow! I gotta say you crushed this! So well written Auburn. Here are a few thoughts I had that may or may not be helpful:
“The world is never seen straightforwardly by the Ni user, as reality is formed from representative structures –not rational absolutes. Knowledge, to the Ni user, is the net awareness gained by superimposing layers of these representations on reality and mapping its landscape as far and wide as possible.” Absolutely this!
“The world appears as a tapestry woven together by higher forces which underpin every object and substance – causing the objects themselves to feel like the outer shells or totems of fundamental forces.” YES !!!
“Yet for all their openness towards surreal ideas about consciousness, the Ni user is not at all random or unstructured in their views. They are scarcely persuaded of most things and are instead highly cautious of ideas overall.” HA, so true. However I would add that I tend to think I’m very open and easily persuaded but that’s not the feedback I hear from others. Because I’m so open to surreal ideas about consciousness I assume that that translates to spontaneity. I would also add that we see things from “imagery” we often can come across as spontaneously creative to others, for example when I use metaphors to describe something rather than stating it literally others think its unique but to me its just a description on an already existing idea. So while I have been labeled creative by my peers I really am not. Lol.
“The Ni user will overlay their schema onto the world and see iterations of the same substances everywhere. From this vantage point, certain social or political interactions will appear to them as clockwork; a series of eventualities stemming from two or more colliding forces. The interactions in a neighborhood may be seen through the same light, as categories are applied to each class of person and their collisions cause transformations through a sort of necessary chemistry. But as often captured by the negative sense of the word stereotype, this can lead to errors in perception where a pattern or schema is superimposed over a situation too prematurely. A person is anticipated to be a given way, due to the symbol they represent, while turning out to be quite different.” Perfectly said
Light
Excellent depiction! Perfectly written.
Dark
Definitely relate to the Ni user getting lost in their mind and having a hard time being able to discern their own imaginations from reality. To me, this is more practically felt in ways that don’t necessarily have a religious angle-its more the realm of consciousness (as you depicted earlier on). I think this exists on a spectrum. For example, when I dream at night, I can wake up in the morning and go about my day. Weeks or years later I will remember that dream- but was it a dream or did it actually happen? It becomes so blurred so I cannot say with certainty if it happened or not. In fact, I would say that I start to doubt myself more because I can’t say ANYTHING with absolute certainty because everything is on a spectrum and there is no objective reality. So, I posit to say that this is actually SANITY 😊 How can we know for sure what is real? I don’t like to believe the possibility that I know. So, to me, the dark is more about the question, “How can I fit into a world that sees things so differently than I do? How can I find meaning when it all is so subjective to change and nothing made of matter ultimately matters because it can be destroyed? What’s the point? I’m a mere freckle in the scheme of time.” And I see that you covered this earlier on.
The dark manifests for me through sensory addictions, and procrastination, laziness, apathy, and becoming a silo. Withdrawing from connection because its too painful and too much work. I think there is a dark side to an Ni user that doesn’t always involve world conspiracies or visions, for me it can also be on an individual level, like hypochondria, paranoid about a “health” issues or unsettled in a physical space. Can’t quite get comfortable, paranoid that someone is going to break into the house, ghosts are in the walls, etc. I see you saying this here and I wanted to add a tangible perspective that happens more commonly for me then some of the ones mentioned.
Overall this is extraordinarily written- spot on. As I was writing my thoughts, I re-read yours and realized we were saying the same thing, mine in a dumb-downed way, so thank you! @auburn
I just wanted to share an observation about Ni-lead double introverts.
"The Ni function compels the individual to live a slowly paced, hands-off life of observation and reflection on the information structures of the world. They are first and foremost data synthesizers that formulate image-encoded schemas from unconsciously woven patterns in reality."
Because Que sera sera, the hands-off + N nature of Ni seems leave Ni-lead double introverts with a lack of efficacy in affecting the outer world, which can lead to dark or broody Ni. Je can be devalued because it's seen as vanity against the ocean's tide, and determinism becomes a self fulfilling prophecy.
@auburn: Just saw your request. I will write a more thoughtful response that is as well-written as your work. My mind is too busy extrapolating too many things at the moment. I would love to explain Ni in a graphical form that I can break down into smaller, relevant components for others to understand.
