I understand the differences in methodology. I'm looking for clarification regarding these theory's standpoint contrasts. In particular, I'd like to understand why ISTJs are viewed as having Si as a dominant function and are viewed as judgers while CT state that SiTe have Si as a dominant function and are viewed as perceivers. Why are they different?
It's because the dominant function of an SiTe is a perceiving function, so they are perceiving dominant. MBTI flips these for introverts because ISTJs may appear as judgers because that is what is extroverted. The CT system is closer to socionics than MBTI.
I believe the terms of P/J in CT are mainly used for reference only (to the "tools" of CT-typing) so one can more effectively read types, and don't really mean anything in themselves (in contrast to the J/P-dichotomy in MBTI-theory, which often is misunderstood as something akin to the actual functions).
Here is my opinion on the general contrasts between CT and other typing-systems (or just MBTI, for convenience's sake): MBTI is a theory that focuses a lot on practicality, and availability for anyone to be able to type themselves, and even enjoy articles which they can identify with. But since it's all mainly based on people's behaviors, without simultaneous comparison to people's brain wirings, inaccuracy becomes a problem. Now, if all one was interested in was one's so-called "best-fit type", then sure, you will most certainty find one of the MBTI-profiles to fit you better than the others... But it also stops there, as your "best-fit type" is only based on descriptions of people who may or may not share similar brains.
CT works under the premise that the cognitive functions actually reflect different ways the brain can be wired, which is measurable (through EEG, and the correlation was observed through Visual Reading). The way I see it, CT's main goal is to lie the foundation for a sound and scientific way to do personality typing (or more precisely, identification of cognitive type), and is not mainly concerned with the behavioral manifestations of the different types. That said, better representations of the different types would be inevitable in the future when descriptions of behavior are based on people who has been accurately typed, a feat which EEG and VR seem to provide..
Last Edit: Jun 4, 2013 15:08:07 GMT -5 by robinhood
I understand the differences in methodology. I'm looking for clarification regarding these theory's standpoint contrasts. In particular, I'd like to understand why ISTJs are viewed as having Si as a dominant function and are viewed as judgers while CT state that SiTe have Si as a dominant function and are viewed as perceivers. Why are they different?
Hi Mark---
The functional stacking is the same in MBTI and CT. So for an "ISTJ" in MBTI and an SiTe in CT, the order of functions is SiTeFiNe. But it's important to note that MBTI, although based on Jung, does not focus on the cognitive functions that he wrote about. This is why when you take an assessment in MBTI, you're not given any information about which of your functions is strongest. Instead, the focus is on dichotomies(I/E, S/N). In this way, MBTI is a long shot from Jung, and is its own system with entirely different "types", really, than Jung himself isolated.
So you will find other systems of typology that attempt to stay closer to Jung and focus on the functions of consciousness that he wrote of, and CT is one of them. In MBTI, more weight is given to the functions that we extravert under the assumption that these functions can be best seen by others. So an MBTI "ISTJ" is consider to be a "judger" because their first extraverted function is the extraverted thinking function(a judging function); nevermind that they first introvert their sensing function(a function of perception). Likewise, an "INFP" in MBTI is said to be a perceiver because the first extraverted function in their stacking is extraverted intuition(a function of perception), irrespective of the fact that their first function is in fact introverted feeling(a judging function).
TL/DR: CT identifies "J/P" types by their dominant/lead functions in the order that they appear in the functional stack; whereas, MBTI identifies the "J/P" of types by the first extraverted function.
Post by chaoticbrain on Jun 5, 2013 15:56:42 GMT -5
MBTI didn't really get a lot of things right regarding the functions because that's not what it's primarily concerned with. MBTI is more like a set of stereotypes based on certain ways people come across. Being an 'ENTP' just means you are sociable, interested in deep things, and aren't organized. That doesn't correlate with how your brain functions.
MBTI didn't really get a lot of things right regarding the functions because that's not what it's primarily concerned with. MBTI is more like a set of stereotypes based on certain ways people come across. Being an 'ENTP' just means you are sociable, interested in deep things, and aren't organized. That doesn't correlate with how your brain functions.
The thing about it is: I never really related to the Si side of my personality, particularly because my mind is pretty bad at taking in sensory data (I miss details often, and I get lost frequently). I took this deficiency in spatial intelligence to be due to a lack of Si. I also am pretty good at insightfully determining the effects or implications of a thought, process, or event (which I took for having a developed Ne).
It seems as though CT is challenging those associations, claiming perhaps that my strengths and weaknesses are determined and expressed through and by different means.
Have you had the chance to read the article on Si that Erifrail posted?
Yes I have. His description puts a greater emphasis on reaction than the structure which most Si articles tend to articulate. I am considerably reactive, and do delve into the worlds of predictability and implication. Inconsistencies and double-standards bother me.
However, I am not prone to experience paranoia, and often embrace change and the emergence of dynamic factors. This conflicts with his Si characterization.
The predictability which I value lies within the principals and nature of experiences, and not of the setting or environment. From my perspective, a dynamic environment is actually preferable, for it provides the opportunity to manipulate circumstances to my favor. This is especially the case when I can find predictability amidst the dynamics; when I can find patterns inside the change.
Similarly, I find little value in the occasion of nostalgia, and very seldomly experience it myself. I would much rather prefer making new experiences, ideally one which would surpass the effects which nostalgia would provide.
As an Si-lead, I would say that I don't really experience much paranoia. Whenever I do, it's usually me taking in new information that goes against what I thought before or new information that suggests there are possibilities past what I want to be true. I usually just get any kind of paranoia with what is usually called "over-thinking things". This is just Ne generating negative scenarios even though there are also positive ones that still exist and I know of. I personally wouldn't characterize myself as "being prone to paranoia", but I can relate to it and experience it in the way that an Si/Ne user would.
I also embrace change. If something needs to be changed, or it's more beneficial to be changed, so be it; it doesn't bother me much and I can't change it, so I might as well make the best of it. There needs to be some variety in everything or else it all just gets boring.
The principles and nature of experiences vs the setting or environment: me too. I hardly ever even notice the environment or setting. I just focus on what's meant to be focused on (what I think should be anyway). I predict things rather intuitively as opposed to mathematically; I get a vibe or feeling of what I'm making predictions of. Wouldn't focusing on the setting or environment be more Ne anyway? It's the exploration process and it's extroverted.
I also don't value nostalgia, and don't really like to look into the past that often. Anything about sentiment or whatever as well, I don't care about.
I feel like the description of functions can really only describe it to an extent. Furthermore, you need to look at how it would work with the other functions. Example: I don't mind change because it is necessary and keeps things from becoming old and boring. I know that I cannot change it, and there is no point trying to re-live the past. Somewhat ironically, this is a worldview formed by Si that goes against some aspects of Si.
Over-thinking is definitely something that I can relate to. I also agree that descriptions are hindered by both limitations on personal interpretation of words coupled with plethora of alternate reasons why people with differing motives can reach identical conclusions. I have also found that many people relate to a type of "alter-ego" which reflects traits that they wish they had rather than relating to a type which is more indicative of their own individual characteristics.