Due to the fact that these 'Larin Video Series Clear Examples' threads were created as places for us to post clear examples of types and not wrong typings hehe ^^, and also due to the fact that these threads were becoming a big big mess (see conversation about it: cognitivetype.boards.net/thread/793/) in that thread we came to the conclusion that it's better that members post a celebrity or youtuber-celeb [create a thread with his/her name] in the board 'Reading Practice & Celebrity Typing' and only after a consensus involving discussion of signals should we post videos here.
So, if you think someone is a clear example of a CT, instead of posting the person here, open a thread with the person's name (in case the person is not there yet) here: cognitivetype.boards.net/board/7/readers
There seems to be a common belief online that Feynman, Downey and Laurie are all ENTPs. This isn't really true. It may seem true only if you type them via the 4 individual letters. But if you're looking for Ne and Ti you won't see them in them.
There's actually a massive misconception about what ENTPs/NeTi's are. They're actually super similar to TiNe in that they will appear "introverted" due to the nature of Ne's proxy-reality. Ne is a proactive exploration process but it is not like Se in that it's pro-activity doesn't result in tactile and applicable results in reality. They can be very disjointed in reality and not flow gracefully in it - as the TiNe.
People usually type real NeTi's as introverts, or if they're NeTi they type themselves as an introvert (and in a sense, rightfully so, because by the "conventional" definition they are --- but they use Ne as a lead process. They exhibit all the "introverted" behavior yet with dom Ne; MBTI just doesn't account for this).
And so if they're typing all real NeTi's as introverts, then what takes the place of the extroverts? What do they call "ENTPs"? A type that is quite clearly extroverted (Te lead) which is also logical (T lead) intuitive and sometimes messy/lazy. The laziness of Te is actually a nonchalant dismissiveness of irrelevance. They aren't the 'ocd' people they're made out to be.
Quite honestly, being OCD is entirely counterproductive to efficiency [Te]. Repeating meaningless tasks over and over which don't create a significant net gain in usefulness to a system -- is exactly what Te doesn't do. It cuts to the chase, finds what works and doesn't do what it doesn't think will work. So it can be minimalistic and prone to despise tedious tasks, just as lots of other types.
Feynman not a person with naive, scattered eyes that are the result of constantly exploring and intaking reality with a buoyant energy. He's very conclusive, decisive and deliberate (J-lead) and not at all scattered. His psyche follows a method and sequence to its deduction, and these deductions have a power/nativity in articulation. (Je-lead)
His articulation is stern/cold and exacting. The articulation of an NeTi would be warming, mixed with whimsical momentum (bubbling energy) and continual tangents or 'sideconversations' with themselves. All this combined with Ti processing; introspecting in a dispassionate/detached manner which causes them to disengage from the environment and lose all emotional energy. This pausing is seen in the two NeTi above. Feynman doesn't do Ti pauses.
Furthermore he does all the signals of Fi. He actually has quite an 'innocent' and giddy Fi. His love for his father causes him to shrivel in a way NeTi's never do. And this is noted in the video. It's similar to what SeFi Robert Pattinson did in the SeFi video.
Here are a few more TeNi females to balance it out. However, please note that TeNi males and females do have somewhat different "auras" and this is cultural. TeNi females wear a type of "Feminine" dressup atop of their Te, while TeNi males can care less. So as a trend, TeNi males seem more dismissive and nonchalant, while TeNi females will be more sassy but professionally-confident.
How do you get Te/Fi for selena gomez? I thought she seemed to have that warm Fe smile and head-nods. I know you said it's cultural and feminine and so on, but then how do you distinguish an Fe smile from a feminine facade atop of Te?
Also I find it hard to see a smile going "up towards the nose". All smiles seem to go up a bit to the side and a little bit up. It's not like the Fi smile does not go to the side. So how do you see it?
The smile signals are a bit difficult to get the hang of at first. They're more of an advanced signal but let's see, how can I explain... Remembering that individual signals are third-hand identification methods of type, and not a 100% guarantee of a type, though albeit very strong (and impossible to ignore as irrelevant) correlations, the fullest guarantee comes from comparing them against all other signals being emitted.
As a general distinction: In their purest and most contrasted form:
Fi: - Smiles: Pull the head back when smiling or laughing - Smiles: Tucks its chin to its neck - Smiles: Has the smile go up more vertically, creating a snarl - Smiles: Gives a giddy vibrating giggle - Voice: Breathy, soft and non-projecting. - Voice: Sometimes infused with Te and defensive/snippy. - Voice: Coated with secret emotionality. - Face: Carries a continual tension in the cheeks. - Face: Tension goes from cheekbone to bottom corners of lips. - Face: Will articulate sometimes with asymmetry in the facial muscles.
Fe: - Smiles: Pull the head forward when smiling or laughing - Smiles: Looks around for an audience and smiles directly at them - Smiles: Has the smile go up more horizontally, creating a wide smile - Smiles: Gives an interpersonal chuckle/laugh - Voice: Has a swell/push midway, and trickles down smoothly. - Voice: Sometimes halts all emotion to process, then returns to warmth. - Voice: Coated with pathos for emotional impact. - Face: Will be flat/neutral at rest. - Face: Will articulate by coordinating all facial muscles together.
But now, depending on the individual's particulars (like the genetics of their cheeks, or their upbringing) a couple of these signals may be absent from any one case subject, while all the rest will be present. And so to tell apart Fi vs Fe it's most reliable not to latch onto one single cue but compare all of them. The snarl going upward will be present in the vast majority of Fi users, but not clear in all of them.
Personally, as a general rule I don't decide on a person's type unless I see around 8/10th of the signals of a function-pair at the exclusion of 8/10ths of the opposite's function-pair.
Gosh, all that to say... Selena Gomez might not be the clearest example of Fi Snarling, or perhaps just not in that video, but the other signals overpower the suggestion she may be Fe lead. Though this isn't the easiest to see, so I've just made another thread about the difference between Fe/Te females. I hope that helps clarify too. ^^
The smile signals are a bit difficult to get the hang of at first. They're more of an advanced signal but let's see, how can I explain... Remembering that individual signals are third-hand identification methods of type, and not a 100% guarantee of a type, though albeit very strong (and impossible to ignore as irrelevant) correlations, the fullest guarantee comes from comparing them against all other signals being emitted.
As a general distinction: In their purest and most contrasted form:
Fi: - Smiles: Pull the head back when smiling or laughing - Smiles: Tucks its chin to its neck - Smiles: Has the smile go up more vertically, creating a snarl - Smiles: Gives a giddy vibrating giggle - Voice: Breathy, soft and non-projecting. - Voice: Sometimes infused with Te and defensive/snippy. - Voice: Coated with secret emotionality. - Face: Carries a continual tension in the cheeks. - Face: Tension goes from cheekbone to bottom corners of lips. - Face: Will articulate sometimes with asymmetry in the facial muscles.
Fe: - Smiles: Pull the head forward when smiling or laughing - Smiles: Looks around for an audience and smiles directly at them - Smiles: Has the smile go up more horizontally, creating a wide smile - Smiles: Gives an interpersonal chuckle/laugh - Voice: Has a swell/push midway, and trickles down smoothly. - Voice: Sometimes halts all emotion to process, then returns to warmth. - Voice: Coated with pathos for emotional impact. - Face: Will be flat/neutral at rest. - Face: Will articulate by coordinating all facial muscles together.
But now, depending on the individual's particulars (like the genetics of their cheeks, or their upbringing) a couple of these signals may be absent from any one case subject, while all the rest will be present. And so to tell apart Fi vs Fe it's most reliable not to latch onto one single cue but compare all of them. The snarl going upward will be present in the vast majority of Fi users, but not clear in all of them.
Personally, as a general rule I don't decide on a person's type unless I see around 8/10th of the signals of a function-pair at the exclusion of 8/10ths of the opposite's function-pair.
Gosh, all that to say... Selena Gomez might not be the clearest example of Fi Snarling, or perhaps just not in that video, but the other signals overpower the suggestion she may be Fe lead. Though this isn't the easiest to see, so I've just made another thread about the difference between Fe/Te females. I hope that helps clarify too. ^^
Gonna be really nitpicky here but don't these two expressions contradict each other?
"Fi: - Smiles: Pull the head back when smiling or laughing - Smiles: Tucks its chin to its neck"
Evanna, I've been thinking more and more, may actually be Fi-lead (FiNe) not NeFi. Very very Seelie. Pixie-like, and innocent. Radcliffe, though, I'd say is pretty solid SeFi.. he's quite jittery/hyper in all his videos, with intense eyes, and an Fi snarl that doesn't overcome them..
peppergirl , @morsecode - I've been curious about something, if you don't mind my asking. Do you two do this sort of giddy giggle regardless of whose around, or only with trusted company?
I thought Evanna was FiSe. Her eyes seem Se/Ni... Upperleads resting, fixed gaze, some lock-ons... I am really surprised by her being an Ne user. I'll watch more videos of her.
Last Edit: Oct 25, 2015 16:56:08 GMT -5 by Deleted
Post by peppergirl on Jun 14, 2013 23:19:52 GMT -5
It's a complex question given that I'm not sure how I come across to people, including my close family, sometimes I have the impression that even them don't really know me, it's probably reciprocated though.
I have that innocent giddy side to me and it especially shows when in a comfortable ambiance. What I mean is that I don't actively "try" to be warm/innocent, it's just the atmosphere and the people that trigger it or my own mood. Then I can't really control it. I think that's why I heard me describe as very "soft" sweet, to the point sometimes I can only be genuine. At work, it was difficult to handle because I had to act professional and "mature", however given my lack of professional experience, I couldn't hide that side of me. That "innocence" has me passed for too stupid or naive in the eyes of people who didn't know me.
Stressful situations can trigger two kinds of reaction in me: either the overly sweet submissive girly side (it's often unconscious though, not as a way to manipulate), and this really erases all credibility I can have ; or (if I can control myself) the totally poker faced, stoic, indifferent "badass" who makes sarcastic remarks. I used to show this latter side essentially to my father and brother, and people who I sense won't understand my geniune "corny" side. About my father, that's a bit paradoxical since I realized he's most certainly an NeFi (high Te).
Something I wonder about high Fi males; do they tend to over-emphasize their Te and downgrade Fi as to not appear overly sentimental and "sissy"? I don't remember males doing many giggles...
Last Edit: Jun 14, 2013 23:21:19 GMT -5 by peppergirl